As Pope Francis returned to Rome from his apostolic journey to Kazakhstan, he held his customary in-flight press conference and touched upon Ukraine, China, Europe’s demographic winter, and the Church in Germany.

The Pope said that sending weapons to Ukraine “can be moral – morally acceptable – if it is done according to the conditions of morality. But it can be immoral if it is done with the intention of provoking more war or selling weapons or discarding those weapons that are no longer needed. The motivation is what largely qualifies the morality of this act. To defend oneself is not only lawful but also an expression of love of country.”

Asked about relations with China, he said that “there is a dialogue commission that is going well, chaired by Cardinal Parolin, and he is the person right now who knows the most about China … It is a slow process, but steps forward are always being made.”

Asked whether the upcoming trial of Cardinal Zen is a violation of religious freedom, the Pope said that “qualifying China as undemocratic, I do not identify with that, because it’s such a complex country. Yes, it is true that there are things that seem undemocratic to us, that is true. Cardinal Zen is going to trial these days, I think. And he says what he feels, and you can see that there are limitations there.”

The Pope also said that European nations, in light of their demographic winter, are foolish not to accept migrants. Asked to comment on the loss of believers in Germany, the Pope said that “when a Church, whatever it is, in some country or in some sector, thinks more about money, development, pastoral plans and not pastoral care, and you go that way, that doesn’t attract people.”